Almost Direct Drive Tool Head

Discussion in 'Tool heads & ToolChanger' started by blarbles, Sep 13, 2019.

  1. blarbles

    blarbles Well-Known Member

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    Update 2/8/20
    See https://forum.e3d-online.com/threads/quick-release-connector-for-tc.3571/
    For an updated stiffer design (also includes a quick connector, but you don't have to use that)
    -------
    I created an almost direct drive tool for the TC. I wanted to reuse most of the TC V6 tool parts as possible. It can easily be deconstructed and turned back into full bowden tool if desired.

    It needs a pancake stepper motor and a non-mirrored Titan extruder. It weighs 406g which is under the maximum recommended weight for a tool head (500g). My Pancake motor needed about half the amp compared to the one that shipped with the Titan.

    Prints with no supports (2 parts). Requires running the wires through the gap between the part cooling fan and tool. A previous prototype to the one below docks without issue (once you remove the frame dock cable management).

    I still need to create a frame dock cable management solution that is compatible. After I test this version I will get it on Thingiverse and put a link here.

    Due to the pancake stepper motor, you probably cannot print with a volcano/fast. If you are starting from scratch and have none of the V6 tools then this is less useful as there is a Titan Aero design out there.

    directdrivetc.png directdrivetc2.png directdrivetc3.jpg
     
    #1 blarbles, Sep 13, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2020
  2. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Looks good. Just need long enough stepper cables I guess. The ones that came with the motors (not the wire harness) were not twisted pairs, but might be a start.
     
  3. blarbles

    blarbles Well-Known Member

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  4. blarbles

    blarbles Well-Known Member

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    I took some comparison pictures between the best prints (so far) for bowden vs almost direct drive (ADD). The green (left) is bowden, brown (right) is almost direct drive.
    • Both: 0.2 layer height, 2 perimeters, 4 top and bottom layers, same print speed + everything else default from profile settings from E3D Simplify3D profile settings.
    • Bowden: non-print movement speed default profile settings
    • ADD: non-print movement speed 2/3 of above
    • Bowden: Retraction 4
    • ADD: Retraction 1
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Observations:

    Ghosting is more noticeable in the ADD print. The small details are cleaner on the ADD. The blobs on the roof are almost exactly the same. Both have good layers on the bottom of the boat. I should probably slow down the print speed a bit on the ADD to see if ghosting improves a little.

    Obviously I've got some stringing and retraction issues on the bowden that need to be sorted out.
     
  5. blarbles

    blarbles Well-Known Member

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    I went all (4x) Almost Direct Drive. This solves a few issues for me:
    • Filament loading and unloading (790mm on the bowden was a bit much for my tastes)
    • Much quieter pancake steppers
    • Easier to dial in retraction
    • Gets filament spools out of inside of printer
    • I have more experience with direct drive and able to get up and running with decent prints faster
    Second picture shows how it is wired. Friendly Octo came out decent... except for that seam - Simplify3D leaves the worst seams. Not sure why they look so much better from other slicers.

    alladd.jpg wiring.jpg octo.jpg octoseam.jpg
     
  6. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    I had a look at how PrusaSlicer handles seams and from what I can see, it simply does nothing. From that, I altered some settings in S3D to try to match. The first key thing is not to have extensive long wipes. I'm not sure Prusa even implement that feature. I think the default profile came with a wipe length of 4, or maybe it was zero. In any case, I think, at most, you want a nozzle opening width. I currently have half configured, so for a 0.4 nozzle, I've configured a wipe length of 0.2. The next thing is to define minimum travel for retraction. If you can avoid a retraction altogether, so much the better for the seam as the head will not stay at the end of the perimeter for any length of time. I wonder if Prusa tries to organise the infill so that it will always start near the end of the perimeter regardless of which layer it's on. I don't use the ability of S3D to output M101/M103 codes as this definitely forces retraction when you might not want it (for short moves). Instead I go with standard, if crazy, retraction settings, and then post-process those into more standard G10, G11 codes which the Duet can then process according to the current retraction settings.

    Your print looks great. However I suspect I can do as well with the crazy long bowden after the time I've spent with it. Where I think you're system will win is in the area of multi-material prints. The crazy long bowden is probably not going to be super friendly to flexibles, and the difficulty of controlling ooze with bowden completely disappears with direct drive. I appreciate it's not absolutely direct, but nothing really is. This looks at least as close to direct drive as the BigBox was, and many of know that system could produce great prints.
     
  7. wHack

    wHack Well-Known Member

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    PrusaSlicer does retraction wipes, but if you are using firmware retraction it ignores the setting all together. They are also disabled by default.
     
  8. Julian64

    Julian64 Well-Known Member

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    I think this is the reason I wont be upgrading to a tool changer anytime soon. I like my dual head big box, and having both heads direct drive gives pretty much flawless prints. I started off on a dual head hybrid but was never impressed with what the Bowden side could produce and then I simply used it as a single print head direct drive until the upgrade.

    Would I like multi material printing for more than two heads, yes but for me the actual nuts and bolts of having a 3d printer is to get accurate reproducible prints for my machine workshop so multi material printing will wait until nothing in the mix is Bowden.

    I still read the exploits of the tool changer group with interest, but am waiting for a bit of a breakthrough
     
  9. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Surely this is 'that' breakthrough. @blarbles is now running with no Bowden in his mix. I don't think his 'almost' direct drive is any different from the BigBox, unless you happen to be running Aeros, which would shorten the delivery tube even further.
     
  10. jannau

    jannau Member

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    The E3D Hermes Extruder https://www.jayuk.org/e3d-hermes-extruder/ seems to be designed with the tool changer in mind. It looks a little wide though .
     
  11. Amr

    Amr Well-Known Member

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    That looks realy good and availability in 4-6 weeks is close but why is E3D quite about it though!
     
  12. Amr

    Amr Well-Known Member

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  13. Amr

    Amr Well-Known Member

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  14. Paul Arden

    Paul Arden Well-Known Member

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    Indeed, hopefully they sell sans break/block/heater/therm at least to get the price down a bit.
     
  15. Amr

    Amr Well-Known Member

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    The article mentions the extruder will be significantly under 100$ but it seems it will use a different tool plate on the TC. the expensive part is going to be the Duet Boards, The video shows what I assume an external control board for the extruder that I assume is connected over CAM to Duet 3 and probably with a tool Identification and easy swap connection (Just Speculation)
     
  16. Cam_Motion

    Cam_Motion Active Member

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    Thomas Sanladerer has an interview on youtube with Duet3D talking about the Duet 3 and this control board on the hermes extruder with tool identification etc. though not all is ready yet.

     
    #16 Cam_Motion, Sep 27, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2019
  17. Greg Holloway

    Greg Holloway Administrator
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    The Hermes will be sub £100, the electronics board is for the Duet3 and is not currently officailly support by the TC/MS. We will be doing a Hermes tool for the TC designed to run with the Duet2.
     
    John Pickens and Paul Arden like this.
  18. Cam_Motion

    Cam_Motion Active Member

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    Will it be possible for you to upload the design files for the TC adapter for the Hermes and Duet 3 board to Github?
    What is the total weight of the Hermes/TC demonstrated?
     
  19. Greg Holloway

    Greg Holloway Administrator
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    We will of course release the files. However that will not be until we have finalised the designs and are ready to launch.

    The current weight of a Hermes tool is around 450g.
     
  20. Amr

    Amr Well-Known Member

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    welcome back hope You enjoyed TCT. Any time line for the release of the hermes?
     

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