PLA jam and fed up

Discussion in 'E3D-v6 and Lite6' started by myk68, Jul 8, 2014.

  1. myk68

    myk68 Member

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    Hi All

    so I had issues with the V5 and PLA. Then the V6 comes out and I think hell lets give it a go, surely cant be worse.

    I started with ABS as this has been said that it cures the inside of the extruder and oils it a bit. all has gone well with a little thinning in prints at times but ok otherwise.

    So i come to change over to PLA, speed 40mm/s temp 220c, it does well for an hour maybe more so i leave it and 2 hours later return to see it air printed the last 2 centimeters in Z.

    So i wasted money on the V5 and now same issue and worse it would seem as the V5 at least printed PLA for a short time.

    I have changed over the set up from bowden to direct, still using the gregs wade extruder. the tension on the grip is tight and it still slips like I'm passing the 3mm filament through a brick.

    Ive included a pic of the current set up

    I have just changed back to ABS, cleared the PLA out and its printed fine.

    I've had it with this hotend, can anyone tell me another that is fine with PLA and ABS.

    fed up
    Myk
     

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  2. tailgunner30uk

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    Hi, sorry you seem to be having so many problems.

    There are a couple of things that you might want to check. Make sure that the fan is running continously on the hotend, I know it is a little noisy, but it will make a difference, Also it should be connected to 12 volts. Check that you have the correct thermistor setting in the firmware, it should be option 5, the Semitec..

    You could then try 'seasoning' the hotend.

    Basically, for your printer, remove the extruder so that you can manually feed some filament. Set the hotend to 250-270 degrees and let it heat up. Dip a piece of filament in vegetable oil, some prefer canola or olive oil and shake off the excess.
    Manually feed this filament through the hotend to coat the inside of the nozzle..

    I have found that it also helps to apply a tiny amount of oil to the filament as it passes into the extruder to renew the layer in the nozzle.

    I hope this helps at least a little. It can be frustrating to have a really good print fail after several hours of time.
     
  3. Ralph Hilton

    Ralph Hilton Well-Known Member

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    Here is my suspicion - your print cooling fan appears to be blowing partially on your hot end. This could cause the heater to work harder with more heat going up the heat break softening the filament further up thus causing jamming.
    I would also suggest measuring your filament width in 20 or so places from different angles. I have come across slightly oval filament.
    If the filament slips with the extruder tight then something is wrong in the extruder. An excessively tight idler can distort the filament producing jams.
     
  4. tailgunner30uk

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    Hi, with respect to the position if the fan duct, there might be something to this. However, particularly with the V5, a modification that helped with jams was to allow a small amount of cooling to pass under the bottom of the cooling fins and pass over the heat break. This increases the slope of the thermal incline and helped to reduce heat creep up the PLA. I was a little surprised not to see that modification added to the changes in the V6.

    One other thing that can seriously compromise prints, as has been noted elsewhere, is the retract setting. Bowden setups seem to need more retract than direct drives, if it is too much (more than 2.5mm or so) however this can sometimes pull molten plastic into the cool region of the heat break resulting in a jam.

    It is worth persevering as, when it all works and you hold that print in your hand, you forget all of the failures and aggravation that went before.
     
  5. myk68

    myk68 Member

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    Hi, and thank you for your replies. I have listed done and to try below for a fuller picture(i hope)

    Make sure that the fan is running continuously on the hotend. Also it should be connected to 12 volts

    -CHECK

    thermistor setting in the firmware, it should be option 5, the Semitec.

    -CHECK, strangley enough as dont remember setting it

    your print cooling fan appears to be blowing partially on your hot end

    -I wondered about that and its only a teporary set up, the ends broke off and its not wide enough apart to fit how the V6 is set up. however temp always stay stable on the cura graph

    filament width in 20 or so places from different angles.

    -Diameter is set to 2.9 as this seems to be the average and is more on the lower side hoping for more extrusion rather than less.

    filament slips with the extruder tight then something is wrong in the extruder.

    -I have only ever used one hobbed bolt. should i try another, got this one from reprapworld?

    with respect to the position if the fan duct, there might be something to this. However, particularly with the V5, a modification that helped with jams was to allow a small amount of cooling to pass under the bottom of the cooling fins and pass over the heat break.

    -With the V5 I had I printed the casing that let a little air over the heat block and found no difference. With the V6 i have the fan shroud down off the last fin to again let a little air past the break. still sticks.

    Retraction.

    -I have the retraction speed to 10mmps and have tried a length from .5 to 4mm and with no change. if anything it made it worse so gave up with retraction anyway until its sorted out. i can cut threading off.


    so STILL TO TRY -

    Basically, for your printer, remove the extruder so that you can manually feed some filament. Set the hotend to 250-270 degrees and let it heat up. Dip a piece of filament in vegetable oil, some prefer canola or olive oil and shake off the excess.
    Manually feed this filament through the hotend to coat the inside of the nozzle..

    -I tried this with the V5 and thought I have got somewhere but it jammed again after one print. do i have to do this before every print????!!

    I have read somewhere about calibrating the temperature of the hotend with a code M300 or something but i only saw this once recently and cant find it again. I have never seen anything before about calibrating the hotend temp or for that matter the heated bed. I got myself a thermal temp gun to check what things were but it never says what I set the temp to. Is this something I have missed and my hotend is actually to cold??

    Sorr, feels like I have rambled on but I so what this lovely peice of kit to work.

    Mike
     
  6. tailgunner30uk

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    I am not sure what you mean by calibrating, I will assume, therefore you mean the PID profile.

    This controls the wat that current is supplied to the heater, PID settings are used as an alternative to the simple on/off method of controlling the hotend temperature, producing a more consistent temperature.

    Here is a link that I have found useful that covers 3D printer G-Codes
    http://reprap.org/wiki/G-code

    Round and round and round, 4.5 hours into a 6.5 hour print and I'm staring to get dizzy...
     
  7. tailgunner30uk

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    Missesd the retract settings. My settings are on a Rostock, with 1.75mm filament so almost definitely would not work for you, however I have found that 1.5mm retract at 50mm/sec works well.

    If any one finds a loose t lying around it fell off my previous comment.
     
  8. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    Had the same issue, it seems my filament was kinking and sticking to the wall therefore causing the print to fail. So what i did was put the PTFE liner (one in the bag of parts that i had no idea what to do with... Even after youtube vids) in the hotend with the black coupler. I trimmed the tube flush with the black insert and Its working great. If this was the intention from E3D it would have been nice to know... Like the design but that a simple issue.
     
  9. elmoret

    elmoret Administrator

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    Uh what? There's a whole section in the instructions for inserting the PTFE.

    http://e3d-online.com/E3D-v6-Assembly
     
  10. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    I did not buy it from E3D, bought it from Filastruder.com and they had no directions only a reference to a Youtube video with no mention of that liner.... Would have been useful. I will email them and let them know that the assembly video is not correct. The issue was driving me crazy.
     
  11. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    Uh what? There's a whole section in the instructions for inserting the PTFE.

    http://e3d-online.com/E3D-v6-Assembly[/quote]


    Well just looked at that video in the link you posted and its the same one... It does not say to insert the tubing and trim flush. It says "if your using the Bowden Coupler, insert the black coupler and insert the tubing all the way down." It does not say anything about non Bowden setups and that the tubing must be used. In fact he removes the tube and says that its.

    It may be me, i take instructions very literal, dunno. In any case i fixed my issue.
     
  12. elmoret

    elmoret Administrator

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    That video is unofficial and only covers base hotend assembly. It didn't cover thermistor wiring either, but it seems you managed!

    One thing I don't understand about my generation is their affinity for watching videos instead of reading instructions.
     
  13. elmoret

    elmoret Administrator

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    I am Filastruder.

    The only YouTube video I have on the product page is the v6 release video, which doesn't cover assembly at all. On the very same product page, there's a section for Documentation that has the exact same link I just showed you.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    Thats the Tom's review video correct? If so then it still stands that the video in the link does not explain the assembly correctly. Can i ask you, does it say anywhere that the ptfe liner must be used?
     
  15. elmoret

    elmoret Administrator

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    What? No, it is not a link to any of Tom's videos. It is a link to E3D's documentation page:

    http://e3d-online.com/Documentation

    which looks like this:

    [​IMG]

    Then click the v6 link:

    [​IMG]

    Scroll down:

    [​IMG]

    So yes, the documentation does talk about the PTFE. A lot. The video does not, but it also doesn't talk about thermistor wiring or other details. It is meant to be video applicable to all versions of the E3D hotend (the 3.0mm direct doesn't have PTFE).
     
  16. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    Got it, went by the video only. That was my downfall. Luckly it was a quick fix. Btw you shipped that quick and i appreciate the service. For morons like me maybe ship some instructions...
     
  17. elmoret

    elmoret Administrator

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    No problem. I thought a link to the documentation on the product page was good, but I'll talk to Sanjay about including something with the hotends themselves. I ship them exactly how I receive them from E3D.
     
  18. myk68

    myk68 Member

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    Ok. after conditioning the hotend with sunflower oil to 270, smelled like doughnuts Mmmm, and now adding a bit of oil to the filament every now and then it seems to be working. YEEEAAAHHHH.

    Have to retry the v5 maybe I can get dual struding. thanks for the help tailgunner
     
  19. myk68

    myk68 Member

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    Hmmm, I knew i was speaking to soon.

    have had to redo the seasoning. And after not that many prints. this could be a pain in the arse.

    AS an aside. has anyone found that ABS juice on kapton tape is great for printing PLA on???
     
  20. Fmeroney

    Fmeroney Member

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    Im not understanding why you would need to season a new hot end? Mine prints great without any seasoning. Do you have the liner inside the hot end? Does it go all the way down to the tip?

    Also, if you have a glass bed thats heated try using aquanet hairspray. Give it a light coat, let dry then another. Heat your bed to 60 deg celcius. I have had almost no issues and you dont need tape. I print PLA at 200 deg. All day long, just completed a 24hr print w/no issues using the E3D v6.
     

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