IN DEVELOPMENT SETTINGS Clever3D PEI coated aluminum bed

Discussion in 'Guides, Mods, and Upgrades' started by Ephemeris, Jun 20, 2016.

  1. AndyVirus

    AndyVirus Well-Known Member

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    Oooh! I just put the PCB lifter back (well 1.5 of them stacked as i had to raise the bed up so i could use volcano with Aero) and you know what, that has defiantly made a huge difference. Just started a print from cold and adhered to the bed as i would expect it to if it was at the correct temp (after waiting). Thanks! Great tip!
    IMG_1623.JPG
     
    #61 AndyVirus, Jun 11, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2017
  2. AndyVirus

    AndyVirus Well-Known Member

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    Loving Colourfabb (Colorfabb) HT. sticks great and releases with ease.

    Anyone got Scaffold to stick to this bed?
     
  3. Alex9779

    Alex9779 Moderator
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    I had no problems getting Scaffold to stick when printing Edge or XT, temp was at 80°...
     
  4. R Design

    R Design Well-Known Member

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    Here's a question about something I haven't quite figured out.

    The very first track (usually a skirt offset from the part) never sticks immediately and so there's about 1-2cm of loose filament at the start of the first track. Usually this doesn't matter (the skirt will be thrown away anyway) but occasionally it then gets caught up in what happens next and causes problems.

    I usually print nGen at 0.2mm layer height on the first layer and in every other respect it works perfectly.

    The start script in the dock uses the standard BigBox pre-extrude.

    The Z height is (I think) perfectly adjusted and the bed temperature at the high end of the recommended (85C).

    What can I tweak?
     
  5. Ephemeris

    Ephemeris Well-Known Member

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    For nGen I have the bed set to 102C for layer 1.
     
  6. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    @R Design I've stopped with using a full skirt, as sometimes it's really huge and makes no sense, unless you're really using it to pin something to the bed. Instead, I have a small 22cm square, corner-rounded- single layer model, that I use to get the extruder primer, babystepping sorted, and I typically I put this at a part on the bed where no actual print model will go. I also move it so it's close to the model. Anyway, this usually makes sure any issue with that first layer don't impact the main model.
     
  7. Stian Indal Haugseth

    Stian Indal Haugseth Well-Known Member

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    I have been printing successfully 1 layer with HTPLA v3 a while now. 60 deg on bed and 250 in nozzle.

    I struggled in the beginning and got up to 85 deg on bed but it only got worse. Sent Proto Pasta a message and they suggested to go down to 60 as 85 might start to crystallise. They were right :)
     
  8. R Design

    R Design Well-Known Member

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    Thanks guys for your great suggestions.

    Decided to take them in order and with the bed at 102C (@Ephemeris I'd NEVER have thought to go above 100! :D ) the first layer went down better than ever before. Am expecting the underside to be like a mirror.

    @Spoon Unit a tiny primer model is an interesting idea. Am always suspicious that the dock extrusion is insufficient. Either way do always use a skirt: either an offset one - essentially for priming purposes but very rarely there's a problem of model interference - or a one that is attached to the part in the case I think that there's the possibility of detaching or am super-preoccupied about dimensionality (eg right now am printing something like a cylindrical hinge, orientated vertically).

    @Stian Indal Haugseth in the USA you could sue for putting HT in the title when it's only a 60C bed!
     
  9. R Design

    R Design Well-Known Member

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    As an aside, just set up a sequential (complete one part before printing the next) process in Simplify3D and discovered that, whilst at the beginning of the print it does an M140, M190 (set bed temperature, wait for it to be achieved), for subsequent parts it only does an M140 which means that the first layer only setting of 102C will never be in place when the plastic is laid down.

    Have submitted a bug report.
     
  10. Stian Indal Haugseth

    Stian Indal Haugseth Well-Known Member

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    ?

    The bed reaches more than 60C but max recommended bed temp for HTPLA v3 is 70C. It can be printed at 250C for very good layer bonding. HTPLA can be baked to withstand higher temperatures.
     
  11. Falc.be

    Falc.be Well-Known Member

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    Interested in this
    Does the pei degrade after time ?
     
  12. R Design

    R Design Well-Known Member

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    I dunno. But if it died tomorrow (when I've finished this print!) it would have been worth it.

    Just to have known what 3d printing can be.
     
    cez and Spoon Unit like this.
  13. GrodanB

    GrodanB Well-Known Member

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    I always had the problem that the start of the skirt is lost and a small after a small travel is start printing... But I assumed this was just a start problem... But when having large travels when starting next layer I see this in the middle of the print...

    Anybody knows where how to trim this? Which parameters shall I work with?

    Is it in the printer? Or slicer?
     
  14. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    First thing to check is that your retraction isn't too large for the hot end you're using (no more than 2.5mm for v6 and, I think 5mm for volcano). Then you want to make sure that moves between distant points happen as quickly as possible (maximum travel speed). Even then, I would expect the longer the travel, the more likelihood for the filament to ooze down that nozzle (after the initial retraction) and to cause early printing at the other end, not late printing. Perhaps you've configured a negative restart distance in the slicer?
     
  15. GrodanB

    GrodanB Well-Known Member

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    Retraction is set to 1.3
    Extra restart distant set to 0, shall I change that to something?
     
  16. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Those settings are probably fine. Though, if you are experiencing a lack of extrusion an arrival at the extrude point, you could try setting Extra restart to 0.2, or even 0.5. It really depends on exactly what you're seeing.

    A picture can speak a thousand words. Perhaps you can capture an image of the issue as it happens?

    Here's an idea; I have a model that I use when I want to test changes to a variable.


    Stick that in and duplicate the model, placing the two models some distance apart. Now use the variable settings wizard to split your process at 10mm intervals. This will let you run 5 experiments. Go through each of the processes and tweak the extra restart distance up in 0.1 increments. So at the bottom you'll be testing 0.1, all the way to 0.5 at the top. Keep an eye on the print as it prints, paying attention after it completes its move and see if you think that value improved things. And at the end of the print, use your finger over the print to see if there's a qualitative difference after each break point.
     
  17. GrodanB

    GrodanB Well-Known Member

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    Will do, currently printing parts for a marble machine so I do not want to share that so this model is good. I also need a OneShape account...

    Will look into the wizard tomorrow. Good to have a reason to check out new features in Simplify3D. I assume the restart is like pressure advance in the firmware.
     
  18. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    No. Pressure advance is slightly different. In theory pressure advance solves every problem. In reality, physics and gravity mess with theory. So, if pressure advance doesn't solve everything, there are still these little was to pre and post manipulate the extruding stream of material to sharpen things up.
     
  19. GrodanB

    GrodanB Well-Known Member

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    here are some pictures:

    First the start-up with the skirt not complete:
    [​IMG]

    Then a picture of a VERY bad print showing what I think is the same problem but happens mid-print:
    [​IMG]

    after updating and turning on pressure advance in the duet firmware this was greatly reduced to a few places on the print:
    [​IMG]

    Will do the test you suggested later today... have a kitchen to build...
     
  20. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    It really looks like a serious extrusion problem of some sort. Let's see some slicer dialogue screengrabs ...
     

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