Vase Test

Discussion in 'Show off' started by Ephemeris, Jan 31, 2017.

  1. mike01hu

    mike01hu Well-Known Member

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    You can use your standard settings for those base layers to give a base to build your vase on, like a raft but part of your model. You can have several layers if you want to; just set your start of the vase process at the finishing height of your base layers under the "Advanced" tab. You can group these processes together and adjust common settings to tweak things you're not happy with. I like separate processes as you can mix layer heights and infill densities in a model, saving time and filament!
     
  2. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    OK. I see where you're coming from. I'm also a fan of using multiple processes. On this particular print, I did another couple with a better first layer nozzle height and combined that with Eph's suggestion to use concentric infill. Really interesting result; concentric infill gives you a nice water-tight result. Getting the nozzle height right meant that the extruded plastic was exactly the right width. Really just so please I played with this model and read Eph's text note that came with it.
     
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  3. mike01hu

    mike01hu Well-Known Member

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    Now I've finished my telescope project for the moment, I'll have a look at this too . . .if I'm allowed too! :eek:;)
     
  4. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    OK. Interesting modelling exercise that was. Designing screws to be printed via vase model is a different thought process entirely. Here's the current model (as yet unprinted) in case anyone wants to faff with it. I have a suspicion that creating this in OpenSCAD would be quite tough. Certainly there's no simple way to add fillets to a complex shape like this. I think it would turn into quite a hard job. At least in OnShape you can mess with it quite a bit, but if you do play, you'll quickly realise that altering filet sizes and the various height parameters has unexpected knock-on effects that can break the model, thus requiring further tweaks. I'll print this thing in the morning to see if it works. I've designed it with the same 1mm wall in mind. The threads, I think, will probably be a slightly stronger lock, and there's a gap of 0.2mm designed between the screw threads. Given that concentric base infill will create a nice water-tight result, I wonder about making the cap watertight too. In theory, this should just require a small washer printed in flexible material and a strong enough lock to make a tight fit.

    Oh, the model link:

    https://cad.onshape.com/documents/1...a011691d6344fe2035/e/ca48ee5eea29e248b120ec64
     
  5. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    One thing I can't get right just from editing the filet size is Eph's nice arches at the top of the sides. Life would be boring though if everything was easy :)
     
  6. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    @mike01hu - unfortunately S3D will not let you mix spiral vase mode with another process. Silly thing. In fact, when I try to start a spiral from a specific height it seems to have a bug where it still tries to print from 0 height. In any case, it will let you set up a spiral with 0 base layers but you still get the fault line. I altered the start point around the edge of the model and can confirm that will move the fault. I also tried to make the center the point which it tries to start from, and in this case, the fault become less, different, but still there:

    upload_2017-2-7_10-14-34.png
     
  7. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    @Ephemeris Not sure which leadscrews I have; they're the originals from v1.0. Interestingly, when I printed my copy of your design, I printed it square on with the axis, whereas yours was printed at a diagonal (hope that makes some sense). In any case, this does remove the vertical banding. Oddly though, there's another type of banding showing even when only X or only Y is moving. I think this is probably therefore coming from small Z motions due to mesh levelling. Ultimately, there will be a smallest amount of z movement that is physically possible, and this might also move the bed ever so fractionally, but enough to be visible to our wonderful pattern-recognising brains. This makes me also wonder about the new motor-combined-with-leadscrew @R Design. If those screws are also not absolutely perfect, you could end up going a step back instead of a step forward.
     
  8. Jasons_BigBox

    Jasons_BigBox Well-Known Member

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    Well, I too decided to have a go at these. Using the 1mm width gives a really nice output for the sides but the first few layers on the lid are being a real pain. I've followed the recommendations above to use a concentric infill (using Simplify 3D) but I'm finding the width isn't good enough. Photo illustrates:

    IMG_4021.JPG

    The print is also doing a big retract on the first few layers and that's causing the line out from the centre.

    Anyone got any ideas how to fix?
     
  9. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    I tweaked my z-bed setting until I got a great connection between the lines. The line you can't fix so easily. Concentric infill will, by definition, have to create lines with a start and end. You could make a change to your retract setting so that the nozzle must travel, say, 3mm before retraction will occur. This might mask it a little more, but won't fully fix it. Here's my print:

    upload_2017-2-7_13-38-12.png
     
  10. Jasons_BigBox

    Jasons_BigBox Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Spoon, I think I've cracked it. Used 50% first layer height and 50% first layer width and it fused together nicely. Surface finish was a bit poor so I've cleaned the bed and tried again, much better. Cheers!

    IMG_4022.JPG
     
  11. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    OK. Well I used a 100% layer height and altered the Z-Bed number in the Tune menu during printing (or you can also do it under Control > Motion). As long as your method works, great news. I also printed a new lid since your post, altering the retraction setting so it wouldn't fire for the model. Not a whole lot of change, but it's slightly improved:

    upload_2017-2-7_15-4-45.png
     
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  12. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Base shows the seam even less, possibly as a result of enforcing retraction. You can see some slight gaps here in the corners. Interestingly, as those first few layers are slightly bigger than the previous one, the concentric patters don't perfectly overlap, which I think is what leads to almost-water-tightness. I put water in one over night and by morning can see it's not perfectly holding.

    upload_2017-2-7_15-10-51.png
     
  13. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Also can more clearly see here where I failed to exactly duplicate Eph's design. Still there's room in the world for both I think :)

    upload_2017-2-7_15-16-35.png
     
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  14. Jasons_BigBox

    Jasons_BigBox Well-Known Member

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    Well, it came out beautifully:

    IMG_4024.JPG IMG_4029.JPG

    The lid fits fine too! There's some fine drooping on the top radius of the lid so I might give that another try but the bottle's superb, possibly the best thing I've printed.

    Some very fine vertical lines are just visible on the first picture, about a third of the way along the right hand face. Watching it print, they were where the bed levelling kicked in and the z-axis turned a little. Not a great deal I can do about that, a different material may not show it at all.

    Very happy indeed with this, no idea what I'll use it for but it beats benchys and marvins all the time!

    Cheers Ephemeris!
     
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  15. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Damn @Jasons_BigBox. That really makes the one I printed in green look like garbage. Your edge is super clean. Any chance you could take a pic of it with a light right above it shining down?
     
  16. Jasons_BigBox

    Jasons_BigBox Well-Known Member

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    Thanks!

    It's funny that I've seen similar banding as you on the green one on some parts and some materials. I'm sure some lay down slightly differently so show up in different lighting as you said. I suspect that slight wear on the nozzle tip will show in one direction but not the other too.

    I may have a go with some other materials in the coming days. It's a nice model though, I like it!

    Jason
     
  17. GrodanB

    GrodanB Well-Known Member

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    I had exactly that banding. E3D send me new rods. All gone.

    I tested the rods by rolling on a piece of glass. The new rods rolled smooth the old wobbled on the glass.

    The new has the steep thread angle.

    Maybe I should print this to test.
     
  18. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Inspired by Eph, I created something else which prints really nice too. S3D doesn't create an obvious fault, and the cap is a stopper this time, fitting inside instead of outside the bottle.
     

    Attached Files:

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  19. mike01hu

    mike01hu Well-Known Member

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    That's a pain. It was a reasonable idea in theory! :( Perhaps a note on the S3D forum might illicit a change at the next iteration.
     
  20. Spoon Unit

    Spoon Unit Well-Known Member

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    Here's the pair:

    upload_2017-2-7_23-47-18.png
     
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